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Aynsley,

I personally think a one day events are a great idea. They often provide an opportunity to photograph venues 'out of season', e.g. Woodchester Mansion.

Obviously some locations may not suit everyone's taste, but each will no doubt bring interesting challenges.


Barry

I agree - there are significant geographic 'communities' to allow local informal meets with little travelling. I am happy to organise one around the S Cotswolds if people let me know they would like one. Great way to learn for us less experienced shooters.


Steve

Aynsley, I know it is National Trust but, how do you fancy a day out at Biddulph Grange ? Is that near enough to you ? Helen and I would be interested in either going there or somewhere in that vicinity if you know of anywhere.

Hi all - been off-line for a day or two, so apologies for the delay.
BG in principle sounds fine, really handy for me - BUT I've encountered fierce resistance to tripod use there before, with an obsession about pro. photographers making money from/on NT properties - is this not your experience of the NT?
Looking forward to your in general views with interest...

Steve
I fit the "less experienced" title too, and I'd be quite happy to travel the hour or two down to the Cotswolds if you have a plan for a day out...
Aynsley

The South Cotswolds are not too far for me either.

Barry

Steve - I'd happily head up to the Cotswolds for a shoot.

Ainsley - I was having a discussion with a couple of friends recently about photographing NT properties, and we came to the conclusion that they have a very biased view of photographers! My male friends have both been stopped and 'discouraged' from using tripods at local NT properties, whereas I wander in with tripod, rucksack, LF kit, pro level digital camera and ask if it's OK to take photos and have no trouble at all...not even a mention of potential sale of images. I have a feeling that they do not perceive women as likely professional photographers! The answer maybe to wear a frock!

Looks like we have us a convoy....I'll see what I can sort out.

On the NT thing - there was an article in Pro Photographer Oct 06 on an interview with Chris Lacey of the NT Photo Library. Picking the bones out of this....

Only 2 ways to take pro photos inside Paid NT grounds - you need a Property Release or to sell images through the NT Photo Library - terms are either you give them half what you make or they give you half what they make. If your images are rejected then their policy is that these cannot be sold or submitted to any other library. BUT they can't afford to prosecute....

It is unclear what the rules are about amateur use but I suspect that if it looks professional then the staff are under instructions to treat it as professional.

The NT obviously, therefore, believe that there are no pro female photographers, and Lynne's idea should work. Anyone got a spare frock, size 24?


Steve

I all honesty, I am seriously fed up with the NT. To the degree that I am considering revoking my membership. Over the last few years, I have been stopped/acosted by their staff at ever increasing frequency. A tripod is only marginally less dangerous than a machine gun for them.....

English Heritage are far eqasier to deal with, even though there aren't tha mant sites around the Manchester area, unfortunately.

My 2p only.....

Marc

South Cotswolds sounds very doable for a day trip. Any month in mind?

Sooner rather than later - this month or early August I hope.

I agree about English Heritage, and Welsh Heritage is even better in my experience. You are not far from the wild lands (they have great castles).

Steve

SteveH wrote:Only 2 ways to take pro photos inside Paid NT grounds - you need a Property Release or to sell images through the NT Photo Library - terms are either you give them half what you make or they give you half what they make.

I talked to the NTPL and got the impression that the chance of selling anything to them is extrememly remote. Apparently, they still have over 6 months backlog of un-catalogued pictures from their "tame" photographers and are not willing to consider anything from outside in the foreseeable future.

SteveH wrote:If your images are rejected then their policy is that these cannot be sold or submitted to any other library. BUT they can't afford to prosecute....

My guess here is that, strictly, you are not allowed to sell pictures of anyone's property unless it is taken from a public area so, unless you got a property release from the NT, I doubt if many editors would take the shots on board. Having said that, take a look at some of the stuff on Alamy; NT properties with no release and nobody seems to be shouting. As you say, I doubt whether NT have the wherewithall to "put their money where their mouth is".

SteveH wrote:It is unclear what the rules are about amateur use but I suspect that if it looks professional then the staff are under instructions to treat it as professional.

We have just been to one of our (few) local sites, Rufford Old Hall. On arrival I mentioned in the shop that we were going to take pictures, strictly for personal use, but that we would be using tripods; the woman made a quick call to the office and all was well; nobody as much as batted an eyelid and some other staff even took an interest in the "old-fashoned" gear.

SteveH wrote:The NT obviously, therefore, believe that there are no pro female photographers, and Lynne's idea should work.

That must have something to do with Lynne's height, Helen and I, both being around the 6ft mark, are less likely to avoid their attentions

SteveH wrote:Anyone got a spare frock, size 24?

It just so happens...

Aye, we certainly have wild and wonderful castles around here, but not many LF photographers live at this end of the M4.

Kidwelly Castle (near Llanelli) Zeiss Ikon Ideal 6x9.


Carreg Cennen Castle (near Llandovery) Voigtlander Bessa 6x9.


Most are run by Cadw (no, it's not an acronym) and are very 'tidy'. Entry fees are reasonable. It's funny, but each time I've visited I've politely asked about photography, and in particular tripods, only to be met with a quizzical look ...

I guess we're a bit spoilt here.

It seems to me that the best guerilla option is to send a squad of female LF-ers to Biddulph Grange (or any other NT that we would like to make a visit to) BEFORE we try and visit....
Aynsley