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BennehBoy
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Post by BennehBoy » Sun Apr 20, 2008 12:05 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

I'm afraid I'm busy next Sat - I'm having to work overnight friday (I work in IT on an NHS project, and we're migrating another hospital to our service that weekend).

Shame that as it would be good to meet up with someone who knows how to use this particular camera to best effect - no manual came with it but I think I've figured most of it out. Although I've yet to load any film into a holder, just not had time!

I'm reasonably sure I'll need some sturdier tripod legs, the head seems to be OK so far!

I posted this on the large format photography forum and haven't yet had a response, perhaps you could help....
There's one minor thing I want to rectify, but I'm not sure if I'm being a bit precious so would appreciate some advice.

Basically the front standard sits slightly rotated (only a very small amount) around the rail in relation to the rear - it's fine until I tighten the rail clamp on the bearer, then it slightly keels over. Any thoughts on how to rectify this - or am I just being daft?
Oh, one other question, I need a focusing cloth - the black t-shirt I tried is a bit umm impractical :D... robert whites has a couple listed, harrison, and ebony - any tips on which way is best to go?

Ta,

Ben
Ben

Apple
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Post by Apple » Sun Apr 20, 2008 6:24 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

BennehBoy wrote:There's one minor thing I want to rectify, but I'm not sure if I'm being a bit precious so would appreciate some advice.

Basically the front standard sits slightly rotated (only a very small amount) around the rail in relation to the rear - it's fine until I tighten the rail clamp on the bearer, then it slightly keels over. Any thoughts on how to rectify this - or am I just being daft?

Oh, one other question, I need a focusing cloth - the black t-shirt I tried is a bit umm impractical :D... robert whites has a couple listed, harrison, and ebony - any tips on which way is best to go?
For the rail twisting, you do have the standard positioned along it so that the keyway locates in the groove on the standard clamp? This keyway should keep both front and rear standards aligned with very little rotation possible. It's only a nominal clearance to allow sliding along the rail until you tighten up the standards. It's normal that the centre block allows rotation in the main rail/tripod clamp as this lets you set the full camera at differing angles on the tripod although I wouldn't try it too much with your tripod as putting the sizeable mass too far off-centre might have dire consequences...

I generally find that holding the top of the camera as you tighten up the main clamp minimised any rotation and I'd be levelling the thing up afterwards anyway.

If you're still unsure, is it possible to post a piccy pointing to the bits you mean?

As for instruction manuals, I don't think many cameras actually have them even when new - I think manufacturers assume you know what you're doing at this level but sometimes it would be nice to have an idiot's guide to let you know how to open the thing and what each bit does... Some of the books we've mentioned give a good overall idea of operation but you've still got to apply it to your particular camera.

Ah, the darkcloth saga! They are like the Holy Grail with people searching for the ultimate one. Some have nice features but you get fed up of other niggles and want to get the next "better" one - it's all silver bullet chasing! I survived for years with a sheet of black material bulldog clipped to the rear standard. I then tried the traditional "horseblanket" which is heavyweight cotton, normally double thickness (red or white and black) but found it was so heavy it pulled my current camera and tripod back with me if I moved my head. I then tried a Harrison darkcloth which is good but the size of it blew up like a bolster case in any wind (along with rain, the bane of outdoor LF photgraphy.) It was waterproof so good for slinging over the camera in a shower. I then moved onto a BTZS hood which is good but the material isn't really breathable so condensation quickly forms on the ground glass and you wonder why everything's gone soft.

There's the Blackjacket which is an improvement by having sleeves to let you use the loupe without having gaping holes which let in light. There's also the new Paramo darkcloth invented by Joe Cornish / David Ward. This is one of the few items available in the UK as most things are US origin so are awkward to get hold of.

As far as I know Masch has used or still has a Blackjacket, Joanna has just got a Paramo and I've still got my BTZS hood plus material sheet. You can try them out sometime at a meet or you might find that making your own is perfectly OK - it's whatever you can get to work with the least gripes :wink:

As for the Ebony, Paul Owen on the board has one but I think they are best suited to Ebony cameras with the width of the stiffened flat across the top. They also need the Ebony clamp to hold them down which wouldn't fasten onto the front of the P2 as it needs a hotshoe socket.

This lot might have helped or just confused you even more! :wink:

Andrew
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masch
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Post by masch » Sun Apr 20, 2008 8:44 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

I'm still of the opinion that the Blackjacket is the best compromise between size and usability. However, this depends highly on the way you work. Mos people will accumulate a number of darkcloths over the time they use LF cameras until they find what suits them best :)

I worked with a Morco dual layer cotton cloth for a long time. Nice and heavy.... Also the red and black combination is great for impersonating a certain vampire lord :twisted:
I went off that cloth when I had to use it in light rain for the first time... It about tripled in weight and was very uncomfortable.

Both the BJs and the BTZS' cloths are modern fabrics and are water repellent, which is useful.

Marc

PS: Oh and before Paul O asks again: Yes, I still have the "Group BlackJacket". It is well looked after! 8)
Real Photographers use METAL cameras.....
...and break their backs in the process... :)
http://homepage.mac.com/mjjs/Photography/

Apple
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Post by Apple » Sun Apr 20, 2008 9:22 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

It was the Morco cloth that nearly pulled the Ebony over with the tripod - I think I only used it once and it's sat in it's bag ever since.

The BTZS has saved the camera in an extremely heavy downpour at Gibson Mill / Hardcastle Crags but I still like the idea of sleeves on the Blackjacket. Maybe if we combined the Blackjacket with the apparent benefits of the Paramo breathability / fastening system then we'd get something more suitable (and costly...)
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masch
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Post by masch » Sun Apr 20, 2008 9:28 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Andrew,

The new Blackjacket can optionally be ordered with breathable top fabric! :)
Mine is actually one of those...

Marc
Real Photographers use METAL cameras.....
...and break their backs in the process... :)
http://homepage.mac.com/mjjs/Photography/

BennehBoy
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Post by BennehBoy » Sun Apr 20, 2008 10:37 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

For the rail twisting, you do have the standard positioned along it so that the keyway locates in the groove on the standard clamp?
Yes.
This keyway should keep both front and rear standards aligned with very little rotation possible. It's only a nominal clearance to allow sliding along the rail until you tighten up the standards. It's normal that the centre block allows rotation in the main rail/tripod clamp as this lets you set the full camera at differing angles on the tripod although I wouldn't try it too much with your tripod as putting the sizeable mass too far off-centre might have dire consequences...

I generally find that holding the top of the camera as you tighten up the main clamp minimised any rotation and I'd be levelling the thing up afterwards anyway.

If you're still unsure, is it possible to post a piccy pointing to the bits you mean?
When I tighten up the front standard, it rotates very slightly to the right (looking at the camera from the front). I'm not getting confused with the rotation that's allowed by the main rail clamp.

I'll post some piccies when I get chance.
Ben

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Post by Paul. » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:04 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

On waterproofing your dark cloth, I was intending to give mine , when I finaly find suitable curtains in the charity shops, a soak in Fabsil, this is a silicon based liqiud intended to waterproof tents. I have used it in the past to waterproof a tent, boots, an old parka, remember those, my kids nicked mine when they went to uni. Any way all this with good rate of success, the tent was once a year the boots whenever needed and the parka after it was washed.
The last thing we need is a soggy bellows and I dont think I can carry an umberella as well.
Regards Paul.
ps. sorry Ben very rude of me I realised I had not wellcomed you, so wellcome from one newbie to another.

BennehBoy
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Post by BennehBoy » Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:54 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Found the solution to the rotated front standard!

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/ ... ostcount=4
Ben

Apple
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Post by Apple » Mon Apr 21, 2008 7:59 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Ben, that should do it - an evening with a scalpel :eek: :wink: Do you think someone's already been in and there's an odd shim missing if it pulls when you tighten it?

Paul, velvet is one option for material as it's good at absorbing light, especially if double thickness. Another option is room blackout material. It's possible to buy it at extortionate rates from darkroom / pro suppliers but I've heard it can be got from places that make blinds / curtains and even market stall material sellers if they understand what you're after (e.g. material for blacking out a kids bedroom so they can sleep etc.) One way is to get a black inner and a white outer sewn together which should stop the light even more and reflect the heat a bit if we ever get any in this country :wink:
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BennehBoy
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Post by BennehBoy » Mon Apr 21, 2008 8:01 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

How do you transport your P2 (assuming you shoot with it outdoors), sinar case, peli case, big backpack, sherpa?
Ben

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Post by masch » Mon Apr 21, 2008 9:23 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

BennehBoy wrote:How do you transport your P2 (assuming you shoot with it outdoors), sinar case, peli case, big backpack, sherpa?
I lug my Cambo around in a large 1620 Peli Roller Case. But only to get it to a studio :)

On a separate note, I took a look at your website tonight....
I have to say I'm impressed! Nice stuff! I like the portraits. I assume they are on "location"?

Have you dyed your hair yet or is it still grey, btw? :lol:
That's why I only do street-photography while abroad. An array of incompetent politicians and useless (read greedy and irresponsible) newspaper editors have whipped this country into a bl**dy frenzy when it comes to photography. The best was the Met's "Denounce a photographer today" campaign a few weeks ago. And I better sound off now, I'm ranting again.

Marc
Real Photographers use METAL cameras.....
...and break their backs in the process... :)
http://homepage.mac.com/mjjs/Photography/

BennehBoy
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Post by BennehBoy » Mon Apr 21, 2008 9:49 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

masch wrote: I lug my Cambo around in a large 1620 Peli Roller Case. But only to get it to a studio :)
I've been looking at a 1650... I quite fancy an 8x10 conversion kit too just not sure it would fit in the peli - I guess I should shoot some 4x5 first off!
masch wrote: On a separate note, I took a look at your website tonight....
I have to say I'm impressed! Nice stuff! I like the portraits. I assume they are on "location"?
Yeah all out and about around Leeds and Huddersfield - I'm glad you like them, the website is pretty much a work in progress.
masch wrote: Have you dyed your hair yet or is it still grey, btw? :lol:
That's why I only do street-photography while abroad. An array of incompetent politicians and useless (read greedy and irresponsible) newspaper editors have whipped this country into a bl**dy frenzy when it comes to photography. The best was the Met's "Denounce a photographer today" campaign a few weeks ago. And I better sound off now, I'm ranting again.

Marc
Heheh, nah I'm not vain enough to dye my hair, I did get quite a giggle out of that confrontation :)
Ben

BennehBoy
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Post by BennehBoy » Tue Apr 22, 2008 8:08 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Finally shot some film - just 2 sheets. Hope I exposed them correctly :D
Ben

masch
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Post by masch » Tue Apr 22, 2008 10:48 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

You'll know as soon as they are developed... :)
Real Photographers use METAL cameras.....
...and break their backs in the process... :)
http://homepage.mac.com/mjjs/Photography/

BennehBoy
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Post by BennehBoy » Tue Apr 22, 2008 10:55 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Loaded up the rest of the box into holders. I'm not too convinced that the film will be great anyhow, it was the last box of Porta 160NC that Jessops in Solihull had that I picked up on a recent business trip.

Where's a good place to buy 4x5 colour neg? 7DayShop?
Ben

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