basic scanner questions

All talk about software, scanners, printers, digital backs, etc.
Joanna Carter
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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Joanna Carter » Fri Dec 11, 2009 12:17 am Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Thingy wrote:My next request is, how do I apply the Wolf Faust profiles? I have scanned in both the one for Velvia 50 & Velvia 100 and saved the file. Can I apply these in Lightroom 2 or using the software supplied with the Epson V750..... :idea: ...or do I need to purchase Photoshop CS4? :'(
You don't simply scan in the Wolf Faust targets, you should scan them from within the Monaco EZColor software, at 300ppi, 24bit. You must also make sure that all colour corrections are turned off in the Epson scanner driver before making the scan.

Once you have used EZColor to make the profiles, you then scan a transparency, again with all colour corrections turned off, and then you "assign" the profile to the image in Photoshop or whatever other software you use to manipulate the image.

Give me a call if you want talking through the process.
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Thingy
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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Thingy » Fri Jan 01, 2010 3:43 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

bump
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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Kintokoba » Wed Jan 06, 2010 8:32 am Etc/GMT-1+01:00

So in an ideal world where both the V700 and the V750 were the same price with no software the winner would be :?

(I see only voltage differences & Monaco :oops: )

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Thingy
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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Thingy » Wed Jan 06, 2010 3:28 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Kintokoba wrote:So in an ideal world where both the V700 and the V750 were the same price with no software the winner would be :?

(I see only voltage differences & Monaco :oops: )
The V750 is marginally sharper, but I recall about twice the price. I use the V750 at home. If you can afford it, I would bite the proverbial magic bullet and buy the V750.... or if you have loadsamoney, go for Hassleblad's excellent X1. Handling the X1 is like stroking your first Ebony..... :lol: ...but I can't afford an X1 :'(
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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Kintokoba » Wed Jan 06, 2010 5:07 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Cheers Thingy, I can just about bite the V750 :D

PS edit. Just bitten it at Pixmania who are offering a VAT rebate ending today, delivered for £508 :D

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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Paul Walding » Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:05 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Hi, I'm fairly new at LF but have made a start at scanning and printing my transparencies.
My initial results are at least encouraging but there is no colour management in my workflow so I suspect they could be a lot better! :?
I'm using an Epsom V750 with the bundled Silverfast to scan and do some manipulation in Elements 6.
Will Elements and the Silverfast and EZcolor that also came with the V750 be any help or will it be better to go for different software completely?
I now understand that my scanner, monitor and printer need to be calibrated but do not really understand how to apply these results practically.
Helpful advice would be most welcome :)

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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Joanna Carter » Fri Feb 19, 2010 8:47 am Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Paul Walding wrote:Hi, I'm fairly new at LF but have made a start at scanning and printing my transparencies.
My initial results are at least encouraging but there is no colour management in my workflow so I suspect they could be a lot better! :?
Oh yes, unless you are the one-in-a-million who bought their monitor, printer and scanner not needing calibration, you'll be amazed how easy it is to get perfect colour balance once things are profiled.
Paul Walding wrote:I'm using an Epsom V750 with the bundled Silverfast to scan and do some manipulation in Elements 6.
Will Elements and the Silverfast and EZcolor that also came with the V750 be any help or will it be better to go for different software completely?
Elements 6 is not really up to the job for correcting scanned photos. It is very much a "consumer" product for those who use diddy digi-cams. Unfortunately, the full version is a very much better product - it's just a matter of biting the bullet pricewise.

As for Silverfast, I have found the Epson driver to be much easier to use and perfectly adequate.
Paul Walding wrote:I now understand that my scanner, monitor and printer need to be calibrated but do not really understand how to apply these results practically.
The essence of profiling is to ensure that what you see on your screen should be what you get out of your printer.

You always start by profiling the screen - this is not just about getting the colour balance right, you also need to adjust the screen brightness so that your perception of light/dark on the screen is the same as looking at a print under viewing conditions. Most monitors come from the factory with a setting that could give you a suntan - this needs changing to around 90cd/m2. Failure to adjust brightness means that prints usually end up with blocked shadows that seem perfectly clear on screen.

You need to profile a printer to ensure that variations in the reflectivity of paper and differing absorption of inks, as well as variation in ink batches, are eliminated. Profiling is achieved by printing out a page of coloured patches whose colour values are known to the profiling software. Then the print is allowed to dry and then, either using a dedicated spectrophotometer or your scanner, the printed patch values are read back into the software and compared to the known values. The profile is generated in such a way that future prints made with that profile have all those minute adjustments applied to the colours so that the differences in paper and ink are eliminated.

Print profiling is not as simple as just applying an overall colour correction to an image - this is rarely satisfactory. A profile is not linear across the colour range, it can have spikes and dips for individual shades of individual colours. Datacolor's Spyder3Print can print a chart with over 700 patches.

Finally, scanners need profiling (but only for transparency film) because the supporting base of transparency film can vary in a non-linear fashion. Wolf Faust sells inexpensive transparency targets for profiling different films. Once the scanner is profiled, the workflow is to scan the film in with absolutely no corrections on the scanner then, in Photoshop, apply the appropriate profile to the image.

Last year, I arranged and led a workshop on scanning and printing LF film. Maybe it's about time I did another one?
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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Paul Walding » Fri Feb 19, 2010 11:56 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Thanks Joanna,
Your reply was most helpful and, alas, sort of what I expected! :cry:
My bank balance was born to suffer and we only pass this way but once, etc, etc.
I shall apply these measures in small hesitant stages as with all things computer related.
Another scanning workshop would be great. :)

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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by DJ » Sat Feb 20, 2010 8:49 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Joanna Carter wrote: Elements 6 is not really up to the job for correcting scanned photos. It is very much a "consumer" product for those who use diddy digi-cams. Unfortunately, the full version is a very much better product - it's just a matter of biting the bullet pricewise.
I would argue this point, what exactly does one need to do to a scanned image that Elements cannot do? I believe most of the tools I use on a scanned image with Photoshop are available in Elements with one exception, the spot cloning tool ( which to be fair is a godsend ).
Joanna Carter wrote:As for Silverfast, I have found the Epson driver to be much easier to use and perfectly adequate.
Silverfast is a significantly more capable piece of software than the Epson driver, however as Joanna suggests, it is a little more complicated to use. With a small amount of perseverance, it becomes second nature.
Joanna Carter wrote:Most monitors come from the factory with a setting that could give you a suntan - this needs changing to around 90cd/m2.
90cd/m2 very low for an LCD screen, closer to what you might have had on an old CRT glass tube, LCD flat panels are designed to work at a higher brightness than this and if you turn down the brightness too much the LCD panel will not operate optimally and your display will become far less linear. Generally 120cd/m2 is given as the default for a calibrated LCD screen, although this isn't a hard and fast rule, I typically set mine about 110. Straight from the factory you can find new screen pumped out 150+!
Joanna Carter wrote:You need to profile a printer to ensure that variations in the reflectivity of paper and differing absorption of inks, as well as variation in ink batches
Profiling won't eliminate variation in ink batches, not unless you profile various ink batches and average them together with the older ones.
Joanna Carter wrote:Wolf Faust sells inexpensive transparency targets for profiling different films.
Wolf Faust sells various targets for profiling scanners. To profile film would require an output profile for the film writer for that particular emulsion, like a printer profile.

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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Paul Walding » Sat Feb 20, 2010 11:12 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Thanks DJ,
I shall take this all onboard as well though I am at risk from information overload! :?
I agree with you to some extent regarding Elements; my main concern with this was that it does not support colour management as well as Photoshop.
Silverfast I find works quite well but I'm not sure how it will fit in with the other changes that need to be made. :)

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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Thingy » Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:24 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Paul

If Joanna repeats her course, it is accessible and I have the leave, I will join you in learning the magic, dark arts of profiling. :D

Steve
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Re: basic scanner questions

Post by Paul Walding » Tue Feb 23, 2010 10:12 pm Etc/GMT-1+01:00

Thingy wrote:If Joanna repeats her course, it is accessible and I have the leave, I will join you in learning the magic, dark arts of profiling.
If Joanna knows both of us are likely to attend then we may put her off the idea!!! :(

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